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Old 05-14-2010, 09:03 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davidhammock200 View Post
980W $260: http://www.refurbups.com/APC-SUA1500...-Rack-Mount-2U

Look around, refurbs with warranty & new batteries are as good as new.
Heh thanks, but I would prefer not a rack mount. And ordering from refurbups.com isn't worth it for me, I checked, and it would cost me $60 in border fees, like $50 in shipping, duty fees, etc. I might as well just buy one new here at that point.

I honestly think my only option is drop $500 or don't get one at all, unless I can find a decent Canadian refurb place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bazman View Post
@ RealityRush. This PSU calculator was accurate to within 20 watts. http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp

You can enter your overclock, fans, HD's etc. It overestimated a bit but I think that was to give headroom.

As David said, you aren't pulling anywhere near the watts you think you are. I was surprised by my actual draw. I thought it would be a lot higher but I trust the meter on my UPS.
That calculator told me 1071W..... which is the whole reason I'm trying to figure out where to get a UPS...
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Old 05-14-2010, 10:00 PM   #82
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Getting a killawatt in a good idea as well. My system + monitor draws around 370W peak and the calculator said 330w just system when its really around 355w

I'm a bit confused about one thing on the UPSs. What would be the better type for controlling votage and give me a few minutes to shutdown? I have slightly dirty voltage, I think, it can bounce from 114.5v-116.7v throughout the day.
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Old 05-15-2010, 03:32 AM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N64link View Post
Getting a killawatt in a good idea as well. My system + monitor draws around 370W peak and the calculator said 330w just system when its really around 355w

I'm a bit confused about one thing on the UPSs. What would be the better type for controlling votage and give me a few minutes to shutdown? I have slightly dirty voltage, I think, it can bounce from 114.5v-116.7v throughout the day.
If you had truly horrible voltage that was eating components then you would want an dual-conversion in-line model where the PC is actually run off of the batteries 100% of the time, these are EXPENSIVE!

However any good, modern PSU can easily compensate for that minor voltage input irregularity, as just a standard APC "Back UP" is still enough to give you thr 10-minutes or so you need for a controlled shutdown. A line interactive model with AVR (Automatic Voltage Regulation) would be even better and preserve battery life for when you need it most.

Best Wishes,
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:01 AM   #84
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If you had truly horrible voltage that was eating components then you would want an dual-conversion in-line model where the PC is actually run off of the batteries 100% of the time, these are EXPENSIVE!
Just as a quick clarification, technically they are running off the inverter 100% of the time, not the batteries necessarily. Hence dual conversion (AC=>DC=>AC).



Also, "an dual".
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:09 AM   #85
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Just as a quick clarification, technically they are running off the inverter 100% of the time, not the batteries necessarily. Hence dual conversion (AC=>DC=>AC).

Also, "an dual".
True in most models, the higher end models offer true isolation, however in either case I do not recommend he go this very expensive route, as it just isn't necessary.

Last edited by davidhammock200; 05-15-2010 at 06:07 AM.
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Old 05-15-2010, 01:11 PM   #86
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Grrr, where can you buy a Kill-a-watt meter... I can't find any here in London...

Additional Comment:

O.o a local library is renting them out... snap!!! Grabbing one right now, brb :P

Last edited by RealityRush; 05-15-2010 at 01:11 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old 05-15-2010, 01:30 PM   #87
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Grrr, where can you buy a Kill-a-watt meter... I can't find any here in London...

Additional Comment:

O.o a local library is renting them out... snap!!! Grabbing one right now, brb :P
wow are you serious? that's freakin awesome!
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Old 05-15-2010, 02:10 PM   #88
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Hmmm, okay so, with everything plugging into the same outlet (speakers, laser printer, monitor, computer) I idle at 350W. During Furmark it draws like 950W. During Crysis it draws about 700W. When my laster printer warmps up or prints it draws about 1000-1200W.

So, now I'm going to plug the printer in its own outlet to see if that makes an impact on the Wattage.

Additional Comment:

Alright, I've got the numbers for you now and need your professional opinions :P

This is the APC UPS I was looking at, it is a 1500VA/865W UPS.

http://megacomputer.ca/index.php/main/Product/BBAP0007
http://www.apc.com/resource/include/..._sku=BR1500LCD

My computer+monitor will draw between 845-870W during maximum load (Multi-GPU Furmark) while being OC'd in its current state, I might end up pushing 890W peak if I OC it more. The wattage usually hovers are 850W though, and will only spike to 870-880W for a second every 10 seconds or so.

Can I get away with that UPS, because if I need a bigger one we're talking $500 vs. $250, which is a big deal for only 115W extra. Keeping in mind the power factor issue will likely actually supply minimum 900W (60% is the industry standard, 865W is only 57% of the 1500VA's. Most computers pull between 60-70% of the apparent power, a.k.a. 1500VA's) to my computer, not 865W which seems to be a VERY conservative limit for a 1500VA UPS. Also keeping in mind, during heavy gaming, I barely break 700W which is well within the conservative limit, and I idle at 300W.

I can buy a cheapy APC surge protector for my printer/speakers and then put my comp/monitor on the UPS.

Do you think the UPS I linked will be enough for my comp?? Or is the fusing in the UPS such that it will fast blow at 865W on the dot????

Also, my second question, the Wattage can spike up to 1700W for a few milliseconds once in a long while, I'd assume that would be alright and is just noise, but am I right? :P

EDIT: I emailed APC to ask them the same question.

Last edited by RealityRush; 05-15-2010 at 02:23 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old 05-15-2010, 03:58 PM   #89
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So this one should be more than enough for me?

Just my random thought, but you could get 2 UPSs. One for that printer, your mointor, and your speakers. Then use the onther one just for your system. How much does your PC draw on it's own? And go ahead and see how much your other parts draw when they are on the same line.

EDIT:If your system alone draws less around 600W-700W you could just get that one I linked and get one of the power strip style UPSs for the other parts, if they don't draw too much.

EDIT2: Actually, they have a 2 for special at the refurb site. 700W+700W for less than the 865w.

Last edited by N64link; 05-15-2010 at 04:05 PM.
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:09 PM   #90
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So this one should be more than enough for me?

Just my random thought, but you could get 2 UPSs. One for that printer, your mointor, and your speakers. Then use the onther one just for your system. How much does your PC draw on it's own? And go ahead and see how much your other parts draw when they are on the same line.

EDIT:If your system alone draws less around 600W-700W you could just get that one I linked and get one of the power strip style UPSs for the other parts, if they don't draw too much.
My computer draws like 800W by itself. The monitor is 55W.

I want to put my monitor and computer on 1 UPS and the printer/speakers on a surge protector. There's no point in two UPS's, 'cause at that point I might as well drop $500 and buy the 980W UPS to power all of it at once.

I'm hoping I can use the 1500VA UPS from APC to power my comp/monitor and just put my speakers/printer on a cheaper surge protector, cause I don't need a printer/speakers during a power outtage.
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Old 05-15-2010, 09:31 PM   #91
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Well, I'm not really sure, then. Maybe you could make your own ups? I thought I saw a guide around here somewhere.

EDIT: Ha! Found it!

Last edited by N64link; 05-15-2010 at 09:42 PM.
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Old 05-17-2010, 12:07 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by RealityRush View Post
My computer draws like 800W by itself. The monitor is 55W.

I want to put my monitor and computer on 1 UPS and the printer/speakers on a surge protector. There's no point in two UPS's, 'cause at that point I might as well drop $500 and buy the 980W UPS to power all of it at once.
You don't need to run your monitor and peripherals on the battery. UPS's have extra plugs that are surge protected and others that are powered by the battery for shutdown. You can run your monitor on battery if you need to use your computer in a pinch during a power outage but don't factor in all your extras when calculating how many watts you need.

As you found out with the Kill-a-watt you're not pulling as many watts as you thought and the surge protected only plugs aren't factored into the wattage rating of the unit.
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Old 05-17-2010, 03:22 AM   #93
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NEVER put a laser printer on a UPS!!!
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Old 05-17-2010, 03:27 AM   #94
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NEVER put a laser printer on a UPS!!!


What's with the overreaction?

Seriously, why? Don't laser printers use the same amount of energy as a regular inkjet printer?

EDIT: Welcome back David! We've missed you. Sorry to hear about your wife. My condolence to you and your family. May she rest in peace.
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Old 05-17-2010, 04:17 AM   #95
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What's with the overreaction?

Seriously, why? Don't laser printers use the same amount of energy as a regular inkjet printer?
Lasers take a ton of power (easily in the 1kw range) to heat the fuser every so often. It's basically like putting an electric oven on a UPS.
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Old 05-17-2010, 05:39 AM   #96
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For a laser printer, it may be best to have in on a dedicated line, like an a/c, with it's own circuit breaker?
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Old 05-17-2010, 07:50 AM   #97
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Like I said, I'd just buy a separate surge protector for my speakers/laser printer.... everyone calm down lol.

I have a brain :P. Every time my laser fused prior to printing, the kill-a-watt meter spiked to like 1.3kW, so I'm well aware that it isn't going on the UPS. I just need the UPS to power my comp/monitor, which can get up to 900W during extremely heavy loads, 700W during gaming.

I talked to APC, and they said that putting my comp on the 865W Back-UPS was a bad idea, so I asked them if I could put it on the 980W/1440VA Smart-UPS and am waiting for a reply, which hopefully is yes. I'm definitely not dropping $900 on a 1980W/2200VA Smart-UPS which is the next lowest after the 980W one.... the 980W Smart-UPS is still like $500 bucks though, which is going to suck giant arse to pay for, but I have spent thousands on my comp and want it protected, so I'll take the hit if I have to. I can get a local dealer to order one for me from APC and give me a lower price and free shipping for it, so that would be my easiest route if I had to.

Ugh..... $250 vs. $500 (then $900 which I ain't buying....)...... fml. APC charges too much >.<
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Old 05-17-2010, 07:53 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deluded View Post


What's with the overreaction?

Seriously, why? Don't laser printers use the same amount of energy as a regular inkjet printer?

EDIT: Welcome back David! We've missed you. Sorry to hear about your wife. My condolence to you and your family. May she rest in peace.
All laser printers will pull huge amounts of power as they are warming-up and charging their capacitors. This can seriously damage, even KILL almost any consumer level UPS and it voids your warranty, too!

Always put laser printers on a separate line with a good surge protector, if you must print something while running on battery power use an inkjet.

Thank you for your condolences.
Dave
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Old 05-17-2010, 12:52 PM   #99
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I talked to APC, and they said that putting my comp on the 865W Back-UPS was a bad idea, so I asked them if I could put it on the 980W/1440VA Smart-UPS and am waiting for a reply, which hopefully is yes.

Ugh..... $250 vs. $500 (then $900 which I ain't buying....)...... fml. APC charges too much >.<
You should be fine with a Smart_UPS 1500. At 700 watts draw you would probably have 6 minutes to shut everything down. I've run a lot more than that on mine. Even the 865w Back-UPS would probably be fine -- until the power goes out. Having the max watts so close to what your system pulls would mean that you wouldn't even have enough time to shut everything down. The battery is tested every two weeks so the UPS will run on battery power for about 30 seconds while a test is performed. The 865w UPS will probably go through a battery pretty fast or even go into overload if you leave the system on 24/7.

Another option would be to get an XL unit. These units allow additional battery pack modules to be added to the UPS for additional run-time. I think the only APC options for XL units are 1000va, 1400va, and 2200va unless you go rack mount.

Uninterruptible Solutions has this refurbished 2200XL for $430.

http://www.uninterruptiblesolutions....00xl-p-18.html

Last edited by jevans64; 05-17-2010 at 01:01 PM.
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Old 05-17-2010, 02:52 PM   #100
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You should be fine with a Smart_UPS 1500. At 700 watts draw you would probably have 6 minutes to shut everything down. I've run a lot more than that on mine. Even the 865w Back-UPS would probably be fine -- until the power goes out. Having the max watts so close to what your system pulls would mean that you wouldn't even have enough time to shut everything down. The battery is tested every two weeks so the UPS will run on battery power for about 30 seconds while a test is performed. The 865w UPS will probably go through a battery pretty fast or even go into overload if you leave the system on 24/7.
Yeah, I'm just going to get a local shop to order an APC SMT1500 (Smart-UPS 1500VA) for me. It is already $550, I might as well save on the shipping costs.
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