8800GT replace with?

[RA40]

An older folding rig has this:
8800GT
450W PS, 34A rated on the 12V+ rail.

Is there an Nvidia based card that will bump F@H within the limits of this this PS?

The first gen 260 (192 SP) is a bit much at 36A minimal. The GTS 250 or 9800GTX+ should be okay but I dunno if this is would be a worthwhile change from an 8800GT.

The alternate is another 260-C216 for the sig rig but I'd likely be at the edge of the Corsair 520HX. Seems no matter how I want to play, a PS creeps in for a whorthwhile F@H bump.

Thoughts?

[onewecallgod]

Entirely depends on how much you can get a GTX260 for an what brand your 450W PSU is.

Assuming your PSU is up to snuff, and assuming a GTX260 costs $200, it would be cheaper to upgrade to a cheap mobo with two 16x slots and grab another 88GT for dual folding. Two 88GTs will run about 8k PPD, while a 260 will do about 6-7k PPD.

[PatonB]

Ones correct, my 260-216 does 6-8, and my 8800 gets 4-6k ppd.

Also remember, you can't dual run 8/9 cards with 200 cards, soo Ones second suggestion is best.

Oh, my 520hx runs my 260 just fine.

[_MtM_]

Originally Posted by PatonB

Also remember, you can't dual run 8/9 cards with 200 cards, soo Ones second suggestion is best.

Since when is this a solid fact? There are people running mixed shader cards without penalty, so I'm abit intriged by your statement. Can very well be that I'm mistaken and it is because of the gt200 core's don't run well with older gen, can't recall from my head how many people I know who run 200's and let's say g92's together with normal ppd ( there are some I'm sure, but how many idk, and if a few would proof a certain point is also debatable ).

Afaik gt200 is just upscaled, nothing done about the internal architecture ( besides small changes which shouldn't influence folding since they only require 1.1 computing capability ) so that's the main reason I'm curious. If you can link me to a few people who reported problems I'll be much obliged.

Always willing to learn some new tricks ( or feats.. or 'bugs' for that matter ).

[CaligulaPwns]

I think he was talking about SLI. You cannot SLI those cards, but you can F@H with both.

[PatonB]

Originally Posted by _MtM_

Since when is this a solid fact? There are people running mixed shader cards without penalty, so I'm abit intriged by your statement. Can very well be that I'm mistaken and it is because of the gt200 core's don't run well with older gen, can't recall from my head how many people I know who run 200's and let's say g92's together with normal ppd ( there are some I'm sure, but how many idk, and if a few would proof a certain point is also debatable ).

Afaik gt200 is just upscaled, nothing done about the internal architecture ( besides small changes which shouldn't influence folding since they only require 1.1 computing capability ) so that's the main reason I'm curious. If you can link me to a few people who reported problems I'll be much obliged.

Always willing to learn some new tricks ( or feats.. or 'bugs' for that matter ).

It's always been an issue....... 8/9 series cards cannot run in the same mobo together. The 8/9 series eues on all projects but like 3 or 4 of them.

I have an 8600 and a 260 in my main rig and so I'm stating fact. Its a driver issue, as i had the 8800 and 8600 running just fine before the upgrade.

I've posted on ff.org, as well as a bunch others about this, google turns up even more. Some guy switched around 4 rigs with 8800 and 9800s anda 260, with no combo of 8/9 and a 200 card working.

Sucks, as nvidias giving people no reason to get 200 cards as minor upgrades.

[_MtM_]

Originally Posted by PatonB

It's always been an issue....... 8/9 series cards cannot run in the same mobo together. The 8/9 series eues on all projects but like 3 or 4 of them.

I have an 8600 and a 260 in my main rig and so I'm stating fact. Its a driver issue, as i had the 8800 and 8600 running just fine before the upgrade.

I've posted on ff.org, as well as a bunch others about this, google turns up even more. Some guy switched around 4 rigs with 8800 and 9800s anda 260, with no combo of 8/9 and a 200 card working.

Sucks, as nvidias giving people no reason to get 200 cards as minor upgrades.

Ahh yeah ok that's true ( as in I heard that before so I guess it is ).

I posted probably in those threads as well, I knew 8's and g200 have much greater architectural diffrences then g200 and 9's ( if you leave out the rebranded 9's which are just 8 series ).

Iirc I posted something about the biggest change being in the amount of local memory for each simd, and that since the problems where with the low class 8's ( 8800gt should work normally with g200 since afaik 9800gt does as well and on the hw level they are the same ) it would likely be a syncing error somewhere leading to the eue's. Could be wrong though offcourse

8 and 9 series work normally together, depending on core version and projects but a high eue rate on such a combination at one point in time does not statiscally proof they are incompatible, just that the cores needed some work imo. Could be talking out of my ***, as I only have mid grade 9's and no 8's and sadly also no g200's but this is what I thought the case was. Still not convinced 8's and 9's don't mix well ( in general, first sentence holds the clue here ).

Edit:

Btw, reports from 'some guy' are not what I call proof of anything. It's a start, but it needs confirmation by the statistics you know.

[PatonB]

Oh, 8 and 9 series afaik work fine.. Thats why i was saying grab an 8800/9800 card instead of a 200 card, like One suggested.

Odd even most reports are on 9800 gt/gtx+ cards.

Not sure what proof/stats there are, as all threads on the subject is full of, "Nothing I've tried has worked."

I can't find the thread, but someone cycled 9800 and 9800gtx with no fix.

[jevans64]

The GTS 250 ( really just a G92b enhanced ) is going to get you about the same PPD as a 9800GTX+ but use less power doing it. Your 8800GT at stock clocks is probably getting around 3300 to 5600 PPD depending on work unit and the GTS 250 / 9800GTX+ will get you 4000 to 6300 PPD.

I'm running all kinds of different GPUs and here is the rough PPD for each -- all at stock clocks.

8800 GTX -- 3300 to 5600
8800 Ultra -- 3400 to 5700
9800 GTX+ -- 4000 to 5600
GTX 280 -- 5600 to 7400
GTX 285 -- 6400 to 8700
GTX 295 -- 5300 to 7000 per core

I don't have any GTX 260's but they will slide right in between the 9800GTX+ and GTX 280.

My GTX 285 uses about 20 fewer watts than the GTX 280.

The GTS 250 will probably consume 20-25 watts less than the 9800GTX+. I might get the eVGA 1GB version just to try it out in the Shuttle.

I'm going to say go with the GTS 250 since it only needs one PCIe power cable and the $130 - $160 upgrade isn't bad. You'll see a modest bump in points and probably less power consumption. You could PROBABLY run a GTX 285 since I am running one in my Shuttle with a 450w server-grade 85%+ PSU. System power draw is about 300 watts with an e8500 @ 3.6 GHz.

[PatonB]

Yha, 33-5600 is what I was getting on my 8800 gt, My 260-216 is getting 57-8000.

Evga has a new "redesigned" 9800gtx+, with a single pci-e plug, I'd bet it's a pre- gts 250.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130420

Ironically they're the same price and almost same specs:

Compared

[RA40]

Thanks guys!

Been thinking of a new mobo to drop the pair of 8800GT cards into. Alternately, once some $$ accumulate, getting another 260 and a PS will get the boxes producing reasonable PPD. Use the 520HX to run the pair of 8800GT cards and pick up a Corsair 750TX to run the pair 260's. It's amusing cause I don't game but having these cards makes me curious.

The 939 rig is still usable and I didn't know which way to go with it. Might just relegate it to be a HTPC but keep a modest video card in it to fold.

[onewecallgod]

Get a tri or quad PCI-E 16x board and buy extra 8800GTs as you can afford them.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...2E16813130136R

With a $20 Sempron, 700 watt PSU and four 8800GTs and you'll be amazing. ~16k for around $500.

[_MtM_]

Just don't forget to keep electricity rates in mind as well, speaking from experience here, can be a real pita

That's something which is always going to be true, no matter the hw you're going to buy.

[RA40]

Agreed, the electricity bill is manageable at this point. The heat is a factor come summer. I'm not looking forward to what the 260 and 2-88GT cards will do to room temps. The PPD bump will be nice though.

[rick5127]

Speaking for mixing cards... I just tried adding a 9800GTX+ card to a box with an 8800gt in it. The 8800 is fine but the 9800 is only turning out 2K or so a day. The info I got from them at Stanford is that you can't mix cards with different number of shaders without taking a big perfomance hit. I don't understand it but thats what they said.

[PatonB]

Yha, its odd as I hAd an 8600gts and 8800gt running fine.

[_MtM_]

Originally Posted by rick5127

Speaking for mixing cards... I just tried adding a 9800GTX+ card to a box with an 8800gt in it. The 8800 is fine but the 9800 is only turning out 2K or so a day. The info I got from them at Stanford is that you can't mix cards with different number of shaders without taking a big perfomance hit. I don't understand it but thats what they said.

Originally Posted by PatonB

Yha, its odd as I hAd an 8600gts and 8800gt running fine.

Rick swap the order of the cards, seemed to help if the primary card was the one with the highest shader count. I'm not talking about using the control panel but physically swapping their order on the board.

Other then PatonB allot of people ran good combinations of mixed shader counts, with exceptions offcourse, but on average it shouldn't be that bad as you're describing. Then as PatonB said earlier in this thread the 9800gtx+ seems to be more problematic then others so swapping the cards might not do you much good but it's worth a shot.

[PatonB]

Hmmmm, good thought on card switching. Let the better card lead.

That is how my setup was.

I really think FaH has brought out alot of unknown issues in nvidia cards.

[_MtM_]

Afaik it's driver related, not really hw related. Can't bring something to light which is encapsulated in the light itself ( as cuda entails both folding and drivers ).. meh nm

[RA40]

Good discussion guys.

I'll have to try the combo and see. The 260 should arrive today so if I put it into the main slot and the 88GT into the second slot, it will mix ok?

Otherwise, I'll sideline it till I get another mobo to have both 88GT cards going.